OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Repairs and Maintenance Questions on Walk Behind Lawn Mower Frames Four Stroke Lawn Mower Frames What is this Slasher? [Whirlwind]

Picked this up from an oldwares store yesterday, has a villiers mk10 engine, not sure if this is the correct engine. Any help correctly identifying would be appreciated.

Hello Lorenz

Welcome to these great forums.
This is a Whirlwind Rotary Scythe.

This one does not appear to be self-propelled - meaning
it's probably 20" or 24".

I would think the engine is original.
I note the PTO side is on the RH side on your machine.
That is entirely possible given these were sold over a
longer period of time - 1950s and 1960s.

Front wheels are not original.

Hope this helps.
-----------------------
Jack

Those front wheels are off a pram!!

Thanks for the information, these forums are great recently been in the process of restoring a victa 18 and have found lots of useful info.

Also the reason I thought the motor isn't correct is it's holes don't line up with the base, maybe it's missing an adapter plate or something ? Not a big issue I'll make up my own plate to get engine to fit correctly.

Hope you find better front wheels. They don't strike me as adequate.

Will definitely get some different wheels on the front can't wait to get it going and have a go at using it

Hello Lorenz and Mowerfreak
I wish I knew the answer to that ...

There is evidence of a plate to mount the engine ...
It appears that it was designed to keep correct belt angles.
I have never seen a Whirlwind with a RH PTO.
Any ideas welcome.



Hope this helps.
---------------------------
Jack

Thanks Jack

Worked out why the PTO is on the other side someone has sat the engine on the wrong way. I'll make up an adapter plate to achieve similar angle for the belt as above.
Did a little work on the engine today too try and get her running. Cleaned all the ignition system up, set the timing and are now getting a nice strong blue spark. Also cleaned the carby it was in good condition just needed a tidy up. Got it turning over with a drill gives puffs of smoke out of the exhaust but won't fire up. Doesn't seem to have a whole lot of compression when turning it over. Any idea what is common to cause low compression on these? Will have another go at getting it running tomorrow if not I'll need to strip it down and see what the issue is.

Hello Lorenz

That is funny - but understandable.
I think you have solved it.

The original adaptor plate appears to have been cast. But who knows?
Perhaps it was two steel plates welded together to get height and angle.

I guess the ideal centre-line would be between the crankshaft and
the centre of the drive pulley.

Here is another photo to assist:-




Hope this helps.
---------------------
Jack

Thanks for the extra photo will be helpful when I make an adapter plate.
Got the old villiers engine fired up runs well now has plenty of compression and starts first time everytime. What material is the cutting disc on tte slasher you've been posting photos of? Mine has an alloy plate was wondering if it is original or not??

Hello Lorenz

It is highly unlikely the blade holder is original.
I have not found an 'original' machine that did not have rigid 'sickle' blades.
The early set-up was bar holder with rigid triangular blades.

There was no need for swing-back blades, given shock protection was afforded
via the belt drive.

As in ...



But nothing is certain here - we don't know how the Whirlwind slasher
developed over its production life. You are helping us out.

Please keep us informed of progress.

Cheers
-------------------
Jack

p.s. That's an interesting last image - with the Stilson 'fish'
exploring the workshop ocean floor.

G'day folks,
Interesting older machine you have there, Lorenz.

As CyberJack has said, that blade plate setup has been cobbled up by a 'previous tenant'.

The Whirlwind slashers all used sickle bar hay mower 'knife segments' for cutting blades AFAIK; the later models went to a triangular blade plate, with three knife segments bolted to the vertices - as mentioned in those ads Jack has posted.

My family's OPE business was a Whirlwind dealership in the 1970's, up until they were bought out by Masport NZ in around 1975. We used to get a few of these older slashers in for repair; they were a very durable and well built machine.

I love the mudguards real 60's styling and they look like they may be alloy. You would never see that these days

Would these be superior to the Victa Super 24? Sounds that way.

For slashing rough stuff, like blackberries and bracken, the old Whirlwinds were pretty hard to beat.

Pretty much on par performance-wise with Mobilco's Heavycut slasher, but the Mobilco had the advantage of being self-propelled.

G'day Whirlwind lovers
Many thanks to Norm and Gadge on this.
Yes, to get a self-propelled Whirlwind, I think you had to go to a 26".

Some might find this amusing ...



VIEW VIDEO HERE:
https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/u...WIND_-_Bobby_Limb_Show_-_.html#Post76458

Thanks for all the extra info, i love things from this era I will keep updating the process I need to finish my current victa 18 project before I put all my efforts into the whirlwind. At this stage I'm thinking I'm going to keep the rustic aged look and make it all work correctly and safe. Will put it to use slashing some of my block.

Jack just another question I'm assuming the diameter of the cutting blades is 20" ? Just so I know when I fabricate a cutter for mine.

Thanks for all the great advice so far

Hi Lorenz
Yes, this is a story many folks will follow.

These machines were made in 20" and 24".
The 26" machines were self-propelled.

The diameter will be the tip-to-tip measurement.
If you fabricate a bar holder, the tip-to-tip will include the blades,
as in the image above. The stepped down bar holder was designed to
protect wear on the holder bolt heads.

Hope this helps.
----------------------
Jack

Triangular blades are still available.

However, I'm not sure whether the original holder on your machine
was a steel triangular job, with same triangular blades.

I see no problem with fabricating a bar holder for swing-back blades
of your choice - if you would prefer that.

As CyberJack has said, you could go with swing-back blades, but that would be a bit self-defeating, I'd think.

After all, this thing is a slasher for hacking into weeds and rough stuff, not a lawnmower!

So either a one-piece bar blade, as the Mobilco Heavycut had, or a replica of the triangular plate/knife segment design used by Whirlwind would be the go.

The 'knife sections' are available, as grain headers all use the sickle bar cutter system.

This mob have a large range of bar blades, if you should decide to go that way. http://www.asproducts.com.au/index.php

New Heavycut blades are available from http://www.heavycut.com.au/SpareParts.htm
I can't recall offhand, what the exact cut width of the Heavycut machines is, but Heavycut Spares will know.

Will this handle lantana or is that brush cutter territory?

Hello Mowerfreak
Well, the Whirlwind could handle 'bracken' and 'light scrub'.
It was a 'land clearer' - similar to early Victa advertising ...



-------------------
Jack

It is interesting Jack how one of the sales points used in a lot of adds from the 50/60's was the varied uses the motor could be put to. I wonder if people ever got around to unbolting the motor to use on another machine. It was an era where people had to be adaptable

G'day Norm,
Many of the extra uses would not have required dismounting of the motor, but rather the use of a long drive belt to the gear to be powered. Much like the mid mount flat belt PTO pulleys found on older Fordson tractors, which were used for sawbenches in particular.

Post hole borers [for drilling the wire holes in timber fence posts] were often powered by a flexible shaft in an outer sheath/casing, attached direct to the engine PTO.
One of the Cobram rural fencing contractors powered his with a horizontal shaft Villiers mounted on a rusty old wheelbarrow frame. Weird looking setup, but it worked very well indeed, and Reub used it for many years.

G'day Gadge, there was also from memory the idea of swapping your Victa (I think it was) to use as your outboard motor. I guess it was a bit too difficult to get the bolts undone every time you wanted to go fishing so the idea didn't last too long. One of the reasons for this wanting machines to be adaptable was in those days small engines were very expensive, the Victa mowers were up in the 50 pound range and back then it was many weeks wages.

^Might explain why earlier Victa 2 strokes are anecdotally considered better than later ones.
They seem better balanced and more energetic sounding.

At this stage I think I'll buy a set of the triagnluar blades and fabricate a blade bar going off them.
I'll go to ghe sheet metal suppliers in the next few weeks and get an adapter plate and blade bar sorted. Got a new fanbelt for it on Friday, will be exciting when I get to use it.
Quick question for Jack would you know the diameter of the front wheels ? So I can match something up.

Thanks Lorenz

Hello Lorenz

No, I don't know.
But ... you should be able to calculate it by doing this ...

The theory is that on the highest height setting, the tip of the front blade should
be no more than a couple of degrees lower than the same measurement at the back.
This is a positive angle of attack. This would mean, at any height setting,
the tip of the front blade will always be lower.

Too large a diameter of front wheel will result in a negative angle.
That should be avoided. This studio shot depicts front wheels at highest setting.
Note how the blade holder appears horizontal.
Also note that the top of the front wheel is about equal to the radius bend
of the wheel bracket.



Hope this helps.
-----------------------
Jack

Thanks very useful advice as usual, I will update when I make some progress

Thinking about making some pins up to hold some regular victa mower wheels will be easy and cheap to get. They seem close to the height of the original wheels as per the above picture.