OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Collectors Corner Cylinder Re: 30 Inch Queens Questions

Hi Guys I just got a 30 inch queen, she is a beauty, it has a 5.5hp Honda on it, but the previous owner said when he tried to mow on thick grass it wouldn't go, I gave it a go on my thickest section and sure enough the motor would still be running but not turning (it didn't stall) I just lent the mower back and it would start again. I don't think its tuned properly.

Secondly can you fit a separate clutch to stop the reel from turning until you want it to

and third, how would you recommend modifying the front roller for a bit more height?

I have photos and videos on my phone if I can figure out how to upload I'll show you

[video][/video]

G'day Damo

I guess you have a large lawn then?
Congratulations on your purchase.
Many thanks for the great images and video too!

You are in un-chartered territory here.
There are multiple issues... and dangers ...

One issue is this: The Model 16 Queens was a general purpose or bowling
greens mower. It could be powered by electric motor or petrol engine.

The Model 30 Queens was a specialized machine - only for bowling greens, and it
was powered by an electric motor. No petrol option.

You have a converted machine that does not easily lend itself to conversion.

I think the reason must be belt slippage.
That after-market c/shaft pulley does look worn out.
I feel one issue is the main pulley and belt choice.
It may be that serrated belts will provide better grip around
that small diameter pulley.

This must be addressed. The Model 30 electric motor acted as the
primary clutch. With a petrol motor, there is no clutch to isolate
the reel! You need a clutch between the engine and the 2-speed box.
Otherwise, starting would involve considerable drag - with the engine
always turning the transmission and reel.

I guess the simplest type would be a belt tensioner system, whereby a
lever is used to tension the drive belts - but design skill would be needed.

It is typical that bowling machine mowers cannot be adjusted to
cut high enough for domestic lawns.
You have two options:
[1] a larger diameter front roller (very expensive)
[2] Fabricate new front roller brackets with a larger radius arc.

What you must ensure is that you do not end with a situation
where the bottom block (sole plate and bedknife) end up having
a negative angle of attack. The front of the bedknife must always
be lower than the back face of the bedknife.

You have given yourself a challenge here.
It would have been easier acquiring a Model 16.
But this could turn out to be a rewarding project.

Please let us know that you understand the issues, and how
you wish to proceed.

All the best.
---------------------
Jack

Thanks Jack!

I never realised the Queen had a few model numbers. My yard isn't huge, I usually mow with a 21 inch helicopter, I have been restoring my lawn over the past 9 months. But it will mow fast with this baby! I have a few small sections behind my shed but I have 3 x sb45 2 x series 1 and one series 2 all 17 inch and I also have an sb33 16 inch. I am currently restoring these. one may just be kept for parts (oh I have another in a box of parts a guy pulled down and never did anything with).

I guess I have become hooked by these amazing mowers.

In regards to the reel running, I wonder if its hard to look at how the model 16 clutch works and try to modify to it, or on the long bar that drives the reel if we put an inline clutch in like on an sb45. I think I would need to support the bar and put another bearing in to keep it well balanced.

Referring to the motor issue, the belts do need replacing, the pulleys are actually in good nick, its actually not slipping on the belts like on a car, its just inside the motor, maybe the shaft isnt connected properly? or is there a clutch inside the motor?

with the height, I think If I made a new roller bracket etc, I would be going into the negative territory and to do this I would need to do a full realignment of the soleplate and bed knife, not that its not doable but im not that skilled. I will say the lawn cut at her highest, it is still nice its only about 10mm off what I usually cut. I will investigate this further come my days off next week and let you know. I may also call mowsharp in sydney where he still builds queens as he owns the rights to it, he may have an idea.

Finally I am tall so I'm going to change the handle, I think they lean back to far as well, I may make it to have a 3-4 locked in pivot point so if im in a tight spot I can tilt it up just to get out of the situation, what are your thoughts?

Cheers Damien

G'day Damo
It's nice to see that a few collectors are drawn to these larger machines.
The engineering quality was second-to-none.


The Model 16 Record is here (not finished):
https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/77095/Re:_MODEL_16_-_20",_2.html

The Model 16 electric used a single expanding shoe and drum clutch.
The Model 16 petrol used twin expanding shoe and drum clutches.




An inline cone clutch is a possibility.
The Model 65 used two beefed up versions of the Model 45 primary clutch.

That's got me totally baffled. The motor won't run if the
crank isn't turning. I feel we are missing key evidence on that.

Yes, this is a great example of how the front roller, reel, and rear
roller work together. When you change the front roller height
beyond its design, you have to look at the bed knife angle of
attack ... and even lower the rear roller to compensate.

Modern greens units have adjustable bottom blocks to make bed knives
more or less aggressive. I believe the Queens had a fixed angle.

Absolutely. Older designs were less ergonomic.
A lawnmower must be comfortable to use - like an old slipper
[Actually a pair of old slippers]

Cheers
-------------
Jack

That is a very subtle way of putting it Jack

Damo_W,

Click HERE for the operators manual for the Queen, it shows how to setup.

Thank you, I'll download it tonight when I get home

I mowed before work and I should have taken a video for you, I've tuned the motor better, but it still happened. I looked at the bed knife and reel and there is a good 1mm gap so I reckon it's to do with the wet thick grass and too much gap will realign and see

Hello Damo and Bruce
Many thanks to Bruce for the manual.

A 1mm gap will contribute to massive premature wear of the reel and bedknife.
This machine requires slight contact between reel and bedknife for a proper set.
I recommend a back-lap as part of the process.

------------------
Jack

Hey Jack,

You have no idea how much I appreciate your and the other guys for your help.

Just played with the old girl before work, I adjusted the reel and it is set good, needs new bed knife it's to worn and thin, so I didn't do a back lap, needs new v belts they are the issue, under pressure they slip bad but the vibration made it hard to tell. So I'll get all this and the reel sharpened in the coming weeks. The reel has seen some serious use, it has some good life in it but the years ahead may require an overhaul maybe a swap out? Also the front roller was not balanced so it wasn't cutting level, so I fixed that, I used a set square to achieve the level. In time I May do a full overhaul in time but not till my 33 is running again

Hi Damo,

I must admit that machine will be a bit of a hard start as it has to drive the whole transmission and reel while trying to get itself going. As Jack has previously mentioned your machine was originally a Electric machine which basically you used the electric switch as your engage disengage mechanism. Only the petrol units had the separate reel clutch for exactly the reasons given regarding the transmission.

I will say is there any particular reason why you would use that machine as a petrol unit as it could be retrofitted back to electric rather easily.

Cheers,
BB.

Hey BB,

Electric would be much quieter as well, what sort of costs are in the motors?

Hi Damo,

Well it should use roughly a 1 1/2 HP unit and you could pay anything from $75 to $150 for a second hand unit. They are a fairly generic unit.

Cheers,
BB.

BB I guess you could also use the switchgear for the handelbar from one of the million current type electric mowers that get thrown away every week

Hmmm very interesting.

I have a working 2.5hp pool pump motor that could do the trick. I keep motors , there might be another couple sitting in the shed that are suitable as well. You guys have got me thinking.

Hi All,

Here is an example of an electric Queen converted to petrol with a belt tensioner to enable the blades to be disengaged. This was spotted this morning for sale.




Cheers,

Sir Chook