Ok as an update on the float needles, the failure rate on them is around the 10% mark, so even though they are a million times better than the plastic ones, these can still be a problem. This is difficult for somebody who has only bought one because it is hard for someone only playing with one to understand what is going on or NOT. The ones that fail either flood straight away out the primer bulb, (once this happens you very quickly have a flooded motor) or stick in the seat and that is using a new primer caps with each one. This is the hard part to diagnose because you can't see anything happening, you can only assume it is pumping the fuel but if the needle is stuck nothing can happen
Hi Norm, I understand that who doesn't want a cheaper parts as less than a dollar as much as possible. That is true, he sell the same parts (needle). This is one of the reason why I'm now quite and lost interest of developing and improving the needle - primer cap after spending so much time on R&D and money to manufacture these products and someone out there who doesn't follow pricing control and drop the price to the point where there's no point to sell to invest time to develop more products. I will not keep my pricing up for long time and eventually will drop overtime after recovering the cost of investment and time and I'm happy to adjust my pricing but looking at 10pcs at $17, even me who develop the parts can't beat the price and it's sad. I still have plenty sitting and no plan to order more or to develop more parts or to improve it especially sticking in. It is all about the support, your support. Please don't get me wrong.
It doesn't help that sheep are all turning to insipid four strokes, thinking they are "advanced" over two strokes. They are just advanced at making money for monopolistic manufacturers like Briggs & Stratton, who still pump out that 1950s dinosaur with a fancy plastic cover, to consumer grade junk. If more people were taught the longevity and serviceability of the powertorque and indeed the full cranks, both 125 and 160cc, the attrition rate could be stemmed and people would keep decades old Victas as their household lawn care implements. The mower shop down the road is becoming a sad indicator with no power torque mowers it the front the last two times I looked. Only two months ago I would see one or two every time. Now it's the Honda BS duopoly.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
Hi Joel, thanks for that, but the floats are not the cause, as I said I have a box of them plus new ones I have never used but I will give the ones you sent a try. I fit a new primer cap and needle to every one I do, but the frustration comes when these new components fail, and in some cases several times before I get them settled down. When I have a failure, (flooding cap) I immediately fit another needle and often this fixes the problem. The failed needle goes in a container with failed needles.If the second needle fails I fit another needle and another cap. This usually fixes it but at this stage I don't know if the problem was with the needles or the cap so I end up with a mixed bag of needles and primer caps, one part is faulty but at this stage I can't tell if it was the cap or the needle. I then have to go back through and test these bits with other known working parts to try and eliminate what the faulty bit is. It is all very frustrating and time consuming as well as the running back and forth sorting out the problems with the customers mower all over stinking little float needles and primer caps that all other manufacturers seem to be able to manufacture easily. I appreciate the fact you have been able to get these made which is 100 times better than the plastic rubbish but a simple thing like a float needle shouldn't be this hard, CTS have been making this sort of stuff for a long time
I bought 2 of the Carbymaster needles. The first one was sticking at first but came good after being left on the mower with fuel in it for 24hrs. Has been fine since. The second one has not been used but I tried it today and it sticks in the seat when just held out in the open. Might come good after soaking in fuel but have not tried that yet. They work really well when they do but not always. Unfortunately I do not have the luxury like Norm of many to try.
Hi Geoff, that is a problem I have with a number of them, always nervous when I know it is sticking, keeping my fingers crossed that it would work, because as you know there is no way of proving/ telling if it is working or not. If the mower won't start before I pull the need out I give the top of the carby a tap with the handle of a screwdriver and this can shake the needle loose. This method also works sometimes if the needle hasn't seated and fuel is flooding out the primer cap. When either of these problems happen I know I'm in for troubles, but there is nothing we can do about it. Every other small engine manufacture seems to be able to fit float needles that very rarely give problems, these things do my head
Hi Guys, Just a simple hack to pop-off a sticky needle without opening the carby or after assymbly. Please see attached photos. Using a Tecumseh primer pump with a short length of Victa hose, apply enough air pressure into the carby fuel intake to pop-off the needle valve from sticking.
Hi Joel, sure that will free the needle, but I am well aware of a sticking needle well before I assemble the primer cap on the carb. As soon as I fit a needle and then make sure the float clears the post if the needle is going to stick it sticks straight away. A tap on the primer cap will dislodge the needle but I am not confident then that the needle will drop once it is in the carby. Some then work fine, others don't and as you know it is nearly impossible to prove that this is the problem. It is ok for me as I can swap parts around so I can get one to work but even so I can't guarantee that the float will continue to work. When I get a bit of time I want to sit down with a known working carby and go through the needles in my failed box to test every one of them . Some are going to be ok, but as soon as I have a non starting problem the first thing I do is swap out the needle because that is the most suspect item
That might work. I thought about a short length of Victa hose and just blowing by mouth. Not going to be very acceptable to the masses though is it?
What about leaving the Tecumseh Primer (or any other primer) permanently in the line as an additional primer. I never thought the standard Victa primer did much any way. Certainly will not unseat a stuck needle valve. The masses of course will wreck it by over use and flooding every thing. Needs a return line to the tank. Food for thought though,
That might work. I thought about a short length of Victa hose and just blowing by mouth. Not going to be very acceptable to the masses though is it?
What about leaving the Tecumseh Primer (or any other primer) permanently in the line as an additional primer. I never thought the standard Victa primer did much any way. Certainly will not unseat a stuck needle valve. The masses of course will wreck it by over use and flooding every thing. Needs a return line to the tank. Food for thought though,
Jeff a sticking needle is a sticking needle and the existing primer bulb if anything it could make the problem worse, all that primer bulb does is slightly pressurizes the float chamber with air and this sort of pushes a bit of fuel into the intake manifold. The Tecumesh bulb does the same thing there is no fuel involved so no need for a return line
Hi Normk and Jeff, I already consider possibility of pushing the fuel into the manifold chamber but the possibility is unlikely. Air is lighter than fuel and what will happen is the air will bubble up towards the opening of the primer instead of pushing the fuel through the jet into the manifold chamber. Victa primer bulb is not a check valve or a one way valve so the air the air will go straight through the primer bulb center hole. This only works as a check valve when you push it with your finger because because you block the hole. This is an easy way to dislodge the needle just in case it stick in. Jeff, to use the used Victa primer to push the air is way too small to produce air pressure. You need at least 5psi of air pressure to dislodge the needle. The needle is guaranteed to dislodge with the Tecumseh primer even inside the assembly. This will save you from dismantling the carburetor assembly.
I just tried the blow by mouth idea on a carby that was giving me trouble. No sign of a fire in about 10 pulls, switch off the fuel, hook up the hose then blow through and she went second pull after that. Seemed to work but too early too tell. It was an old plastic needle. Its a nuisance that there is no way of telling if you have fuel in the carby or not.
I was thinking of a primer bulb from a chain saw or similar, has to be one that fits in a line not on the bottom of the carby. They are only about $1.50 but are not quite big enough in line diameter for the Victa line. For about $5.00 you can get the outboard motor style, probably too big. I wonder if you would feel the resistance when the needle valve closes like you do in a car or outboard. I think the Victa primers are a waste of space. I never could see how they are supposed to work.
Jeff the primer bulb is not a waste of space, try starting one without using it. I find that a gentle tap on the top of the carby usually will free a sticking needle, it is just that you can't tell a customer to start blowing on the hose when they don't have this sort of problem with the 4 strokes. And what do you think you have done by blowing on the hose Jeff, you have pressurized the float chamber and this has pushed a bit of fuel in through the main jet and towards the inlet manifold and that is all it takes to get it to start
Jeff, using an inline primer also could be an option since there's actually a check valve in it. When you squeeze the primer, it pushes the fuel in one direction only (towards the needle) and will create enough pressure to dislodge the needle. But this method has to done 1 to 3 press otherwise you will completely filled up the chamber with fuel until you will see the fuel overflow through the primer bulb. Norm, I don't believe by doing this will push the fuel into the manifold because of the back pressure from the manifold which stops the fuel from freely flowing through the jet and also with air pressure, the air will bubble to the primer out because it's always open for fuel overflow. As you can see that the jet level is below the maximum fuel level inside the chamber and why it doesn't freely flow into the manifold - that's because of the back pressure. The only time the fuel is sucked through the jet into the manifold when there's a movement of the piston and diaphragm which create vacuum through the so call Venturi or Bernoulli's principle which states that an increase in the speed of a fluid occurs simultaneously with a decrease in pressure or a decrease in the fluid's potential energy. One other thing you might experiment with one faulty needle is to place the needle inside an oven at 140� for 30min and gradually cool down the temperature in order to harden the rubber tip. This is the problem with all rubber tip needles are likely to stick into the seat and now we see this on Victa carby because the needle doesn't have a hook and the release relies only on the gravity or the weight of the needle and fuel pressure unlike other needles that have metering lever or float hook. There is a trade off when you harden the rubber tip, the needle won't stick but you loose the sealing ability.
It's just the way they are. This is an Achilles heel with the design that won't go away entirely. When they work right, they are a generally reliable carburettor and are easy to work on once you learn which bit goes where. The ptrimer bulb most certainly is a benefit. Only the other day with my inward facing G4, it wouldn't kick over until I went to the effort to push the primer bulb hiding behind a couple of times before it fired up first pull.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
Just got another one on its way back here with float needle pissing out, getting really close to giving up on these Victas, too many float needle problems
Sorry to hear that. It could even be OK by the time it gets to you after a ride in the car. I wonder if there is some foreign matter in the seat. I only work on my own family's mowers but I can understand how frustrating it would be to have this happen on customers machines. Of the two problems flooding is at least easy to see.
Its just that when they do work these carbys work so well, particularly with your modifications. Strangely a few of the really old original Victa plastic needles seem to be OK. If they work I leave them alone.
