OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Collectors Corner Identification of Particular Machines Victa Model 4 Automatic Specifications

Well that number is spot on confirming what Blue has said all along, it also has another fine example of the leather starter (that has not been taken into concideration when talking about starters) it is identical to the starter that my early Auto came with and was told by the bloke I got it off that the original owner had told him that "it still has the original leather starter" so this is something else I have never heard discussed or even concidered as being standard equipment???, the handle on mine has just been chewed a bit by a dog but is identical to the one above.


food for thought.

Yep, Blue was on the ball with this one. I have a Model 5 version 1 with a serial in the 189,000 so it appears this "first off the production line" was more likely retained simply for being the 200,000 mower produced.

Regarding you pull starter, what a survivor! Dog chewed or not, it is probably one of only a few in existence!

Speaking of Accessories, here's my latest acquisition for my Auto:

Very nice work there Unki, now tell me as I have been thinking about what Blue said about this spanner having flat ends on the bar, but what I thought then it would not be able to have been used for the height adjuster?? so does it have the flat part on the inside of the tube to stop the bar comming out?? because thats what I did when I made the bar for mine. As far as I know, that spanner is a a first, and looks in good original condition too well done again.

Not sure on the bar but will let you know as soon as I can check it over. As far as I can tell it's the real deal, possibly the first I've seen, as it is uniformly galvanised and looks accurate - fingers crossed!

I meant to ask you, have you power washed your #125166 yet? I'm curious to know if the axle housings showed any evidence of having been painted like the earlier Autos..

And while we are straying of topic, what were Victa thinking when they did away with the left side skirt bolts but decided to retain the front and rear flap retainers in the base? I wonder if they had not given up hope of getting the predicta set up working properly, Hmmmmm.

No have not done anything to it as yet, but could check it out a little better and get back to you.

Aso all Auto's must have finished their run before 58 cause the series 1 there has the Concord sticker on it. Sorry a lot of you and Blues time line stuff has not sunk in properly yet but have you come to any firm start of and finish of for the model 4, be it an Auto or a special, just any maodel 4 in other words?

Ahh cool, I look forward to hearing about it.


I think the edger slot and adjacent bolts were retained in the hope of one day making the edger "non-lethal" and as you said, the hope of retaining the Predicta option also played a part in the Version 1 base design. From what I can gather, Mr. Richardson was not one to give up easily, and probably hoped to produce a mower that could be accessorised not unlike a car. In the vein of Henry Ford, the guy really was a stubborn industrialist who had supreme confidence in the viability of his inventive skills - even if they had "teathing" problems lol

Start time is definitely August/September '57, with a serial starting around 110,000, but a finish date is what we are searching for. Allot of overlap appears between the models,but the Auto was last advertised 13 March '58. So only 7 short months on sale...how long the Auto parts continued to be used? Still to be determined...

Very nice aquisition Unkie...I WILL go so far as to say its the Real Deal!. Jonesy My mention of flat ends was merely an assumption. Id been told may times of the Autos being a straight bar,but never seen one in real life. Mine as I mentioned is just a made 1/4inch bar . My assumption was that it may have had pressed ends to keep in in one piece so you wouldnt lose the bar. But since next to none exist,Id say over time they just got lost,thats why all the later models have bent ends .Either way Im happy cause I have this bar in my stash of goodies,and can now use it,With ceratainty its correct.

Now with Unkies Diagram and Example,Id say its time to rest this one up As Case Closed !

Your rope starter is correct in style Jonesy! whether its been made up or original,it is the type they used from the Rotomo right through. (although at the risk of offence,This could not be the original rope off your Auto,as the previous owner stated,As they Did NOT come with a rope starter option...Auto had Recoil only). In any case its still a coorect style example .I have a few of these,most are nylon rope now but I have one with old style cord that came with an original family owned Model 5S1...I like the Dog chewed look anyways. I can Just Imagine old man starting the mower and then the dog nicking of with its new chew toy!! lols.

As for the Edger,Who really knows. As far as im aware a patent existed,but was to dangerous to put into production. As unkie says,Ol man Victa was a very determined man. Also With production going so fast it was put on the back burner. But Im positive it was still in the back of his mind. Especially since it was re explored. on the Sheerline Model 6/9 chassis

Domt worry jonesy we will get there with a definate on the elusive start finish dates As the gaps keep getting smaller and smaller....

Two quick things to keep exploring...
1:What were the remaining Non Auto Model 4s Truly equipped with before the model 5 S1 Started?...ONLY Automatic left overs( Badges Fuel Taps,Groove cover nuts and of course bases) Or A Special badge somewhere in the mix?.
2: What was the Month/Date the Model 5 S1 Was realeased And what Serial did it truly start with?... A point to note is...If this truly is the first model 5 S1 released,would you not want your First 5 S1/flagship to be fully equipped or with at least a recoil starter and screen? The donation of this early 200,000th Victa would be given in my opinion as a True milestoone of Victas ever growing Success...Just something to ponder over:)


Great topics and discussion on the spanner and starter guys! Awesome

Hi Guys, this thread is going to be hard to unravel if we keep sliding 'off topic'....some posts will have to be moved to another topic at some stage.....Maybe we should open another thread on the Model 5, but I do see the prob, both seem to be entwined and perhaps in production at the same time (The early M5 S1).....
The plot thickens.

Lol agreed Deejay, it is getting messy! A new thread may be a little premature at this point as I think that the model classification is even cloudier than we first thought....more on that later.

For now, If everyone could take a good hard look at this image - don't jump the gun and assume this or that - and tell me what you think this is:



It does have bearing on the Automatic, but I won't elaborate any further at this point. Would love to hear any thoughts on it.

the code is a little hard to read, but zoomed in looks to be: DAL 21304

dont really know what you are looking for here Unkie, but is that number on the wrong side of the crank cases?

an exact length of your spanner bar would be nice and detail as I said before of how it is held in place??

Ooooooh guessing games....No Assumptions? awwww.

Ill tell you what I see in the Image....A Crankcase,lols.

Ok the crankase has its original pattina and shine. (A Very Slight possibility its been painted,but It looks to be the original casting shine).
The nuts still retain nearly all of their plating,indicating little use.
The green of the base is very strong,again indicating little use.
In the lower left you can see an axle housing bolt. it is sitting on what appears to be a green axle housing.
The serial number is on the bottom Crank half,not top and there is no line code.
The serial indicates its a sheerline lower crank half due to the DAL serial prefix and its lower crank half positioning.
The serial numbers appear to have been sanded down or ground over .
The only bearing i can see to it being related to the automatic would be the painted axle housing....As it appears to be in Avocado same as the base.
Either way this mower seems to have seen little action from what can be seen

Do I get a prize for having NO Idea? Lmao....

I'll have to get back to you Jonesy on the length of the bar as i cant get at look at it until next week.

That crank case is held at the Powerhouse Museum....and is attached to this mower:

and the number is on the left, as you can see the base of the barrel on the right hand side and also the rise in the base for the exhaust to enter, very starange as this mower does not have left hand edge bolts either, come to think about it the so called flaps look to be part of the base like it is all cast as a base? what else do you know about it Unkie? any more photos? interesting

just had a closer look and it does have cables front and back with no hand throttle, must be a series 1 base.

Sorry mate, no other photos at this point. I'll try and get some more asap. I'm pretty unsure as to what I should make of this mower...It poses more questions than answers, but yep that's a model 5 base alright

It's just a bitsa! I know where they can put those flaps to make better use of them.

If that's how the Powerhouse museum looks after their goods it is a disgrace, it's a bit hard to tell for sure but it looks to have the green rubber on the starter handle, and can't really distinguish what is on the end of the hadle, it sort of looks a bit like a bolt?

Agreed Jonesy,if it is actually on display. Its tagged and messy and looks to be in the undisplayed storage section. Either way it seemingly appears to be a replica of an Automatic. Unfortunately the museum doesnt always know all the facts regarding some of its pieces. They rely on information from the Donor and often just a basic general knowledge of some items displayed. Ive bought excess museum pieces a few times and always they knew nothing,except what was on the badge,and occcasionally a brief owner history. I had to appraise them and show proof before I could purchase in some cases. Anyways getting of topic a bit,back to the mower. Whether this is actually an Auto,will remain purely speculation,But Id doubt it. Overall Colouring appears accurate,even with the lighter handle bar colour. Ive seen this shade many times for this era,as colour was sometimes not uniform. So we have An automatic with an incorrect base,and engine. The rest appears to be acceptable from what can be seen at this point. The question is how did it become like this? Is it Simply An old restoration to make a replica,You would almost certainly assume this to be the case. The boot does appear green as you say. What you can see on the end is the exposed alloy top,as it was not covered by the boot.

Since it would be unfair to dismiss this so easily without all its history,we can only make assumptions form what we know to be accurate...And this falls short in so many ways. Is it real or restored? You Decide...Since I can confirm this serial falls inside the early Sheerline run,and the later base,and lack of side guards.( If it was just the base alone,and not the Engine as well that was wrong,then Id re think my conclusions.) So Id say almost definately this is just a Replica. And probably should be left here to stop any speculation or confusion. Just my Opinion.

Im Unsure of your familiarity of the starter knob Jonesy. (Re Your query/uncertainty about the end of the starter handle on the Bitsa) Im sure youve seen them apart,but Just in case Ive included some Images for the thread,since I dont think we have a starter or knob image as yet . This Starter is from a model 5 With its use on the Model 4 yet to be Confirmed...The Model 4 starter difference is the exclusion of the visible spring retaining pin on the left. The internals are also the same with a few minor exceptions,Brass(early)or stainless carrier washers,and 2 different Pawl styles,but really they are the same.

so where/when was the wire rope starter i heard of from ? sorry if it has been talked about in tis thread before i might have missed it . only heard of it once and never seen one

Hey VC...
All Model 4 Automatics that Im aware of were wire cord starters,and the first Model to use this starter type,so 1957. It was replaced by the rope/cord style on the Model 5 S1 and then was reintroduced later in the series. The ends of the wire have a ball and it threads into the handle in the Image and the 2 halves are then joined and the Green or black Rubber boot goes over the knob..
The starter in the Image is also a wire cord starter,just the next version(This is the one your enquiring about)

Ill get some pics of all 3 recoil starters when I can so you can see the differences.

that would be great yes , i think i have one ? but replaced with rope , a common thing ? or maybe it wouldnt work , seems the wire one's most the worse for wear , deep cuts in the alloy seen a little in one picture of the knob starter

Yep Blue, am aware of the end of the starter not being covered by the rubber but when I zoomed right in I think I can see what looks to be two like lock nuts on some sort of thread? I may be mistaken but that's what I was referring to.

All good then Jonesy! Ill have a peek,your probably right That would just make it even more of a bitsa! lols.

Hey guys just having a play around with my phone at work and just experimenting with a quick way to import some info supplied by Blue, from my thread without having to do a lot of typing, if it doesn't work I'm sure Deejay could delete it

The Automatic with the predicta set up was fitted with a twin cable slide in the carby and had a twin cable top on the carby.


The following information is supplied Blumbly.