OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Repairs and Maintenance Questions on Walk Behind Lawn Mower Frames Four Stroke Lawn Mower Frames Rockwell - Slightly Broken Mower Disc. Fixing?

Hi guys,

So I have a cheap ROCKWELL mower with the CHONDA engine.. managed to get it running to sell.. however, i removed the blade disc to sharpen the blades, re-installed, started it up and noticed a loud rattling sound.

Thinking I did something when installing the blade disc, I removed it and noticed a small piece broken off.. has anyone encountered something like this and managed to fix it?



I might have access to a welder and maybe some rods.. but I wouldnt have a clue how to use it (ie. what settings, what rods etc..)

I would replace the disc.. but being a cheap mower, I doubt I would find one with the same style.. and I certainly didn't want to have to replace the boss.. will only add to costs..

Thoughts, suggestions, tips etc.. much appreciated.

Regards

So what was the rattling sound, my guess is the blade carrier was loose on the crank bolt, the tabs are only to help prevent the blade carrier from spinning, The center bolt needs to be tight and should hold, the tabs are there to help. If you don't know how to set the welder, do not attempt to learn how to weld on a component that is going to spin at high speed

Hmmm good question.. I just assumed as the tab was broken off, it was the rattle .. though as you mentioned the centre bolt, I do recall it being tight .. Ill have to have another inspection tomorrow.

The step on the boss has to be lower than the thickness of the blade carrier or have a stepped washer so that the blade carrier is sandwiched up tight when the bolt/nut is tightened. The clamping force is what has to hold the carrier tight

Won't there be balancing issues with the piece missing? What a pain of a design, especially when this type of disk isn't common.

The missing piece is so minimal in weight and is in close to the crank, it is a cingle cylinder motor so you would never feel any vibration. If it concerns you then just throw it out, there is a million designs of base plates and manufactures don't give a toss if you have problems with it, their only interest is selling mowers, not having them fixed up

so!.. quick update .. I checked the crank shaft just in-case it was faulty bearing, but nope.. without that 3rd tab, the plate doesn't seem to secure properly into the shaft.. even when doing up tight

[video][/video]

I did the bolt up extra tight, and seemed to reduce the movement.. but.. after running the mower for a couple minutes and shutting down.. I noticed the blade-carrier took long to stop.. removed the carrier and noticed the last 2 tabs goooone...



So! .. I guess my option are now,

1- Replace carrier + Boss (just carrier if I can find one the same style.. not holding breath)

2- Weld (or get someone to weld) mew, thicker, stronger tabs..

3- Try sell as is at reduced price.. someone else can havce a go and fixing the carrier or buy replacement...

Think I'm gonna go fishing with #3, see if I get any bites...

Thanks

As I explained earlier, the base nut wasn't tight, it might have bottomed out on the bolt/nut, but it wasn't clamping the carrier tight and it was relying on the tabs to do the work and as you can see they are not designed to do that. Thicker stronger tabs are not the answer, the original tabs were fine for purpose, just asked to do more than they were designed to do

Just pull the blade carrier/boss off a GMC, they're generally an easy enough swap over and use the same honda style blades and bolts.

thanks guys,



Thanks bigted, I had a quick look on ebay and gumtree.. nop such luck though ill keep an eye out

However, I did come across the same carrier on ebay.. looks like its a HONDA carrier that's on there.. though at $30.. yeh nah .. bit much for a cheap mower.. I might pop over to the buy/sell section and HONDA section.. see if anyone's selling..

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Honda-Lawn-Mower-DISK-BLADE-CARRIER-HOLDER-Honda-19-21-/330848986066?hash=item4d0822e3d2:g:d6wAAMXQhuVROW64

Thanks

No point in just replacing the blade carrier without addressing the reason why it tore the lugs off, because it will do it again

Norm's right. Most disc type blade carriers don't have tabs anyway but rely on clamping force to hold the plate so unless you work out why you aren't clamping hard enough a replacement plate will just tear off the lugs again. You sure you didn't lose a washer during dismantling? Or if it is a nyloc nut, it may be in need of replacement. Technically speaking Nyloc nuts are a single use item.

Hey guys, you're right.. but im stumped, as there doesn't seem to be much to it.

> Carrier goes on with tabs in holes

> washer goes on

> Bolt screws on till tight

There shouldn't be any reason for that to happen.. at least from what I can see.. so unless I'm missing something or the tabs go into specific holes (which I doubt). Aussietrev, you mentioned you had a carrier.. what sort of assembly did it have? Im trying to track down a teardown view of the disc carrier, but no luck.

G'day all,

This is just a comment.
I wonder whether the washer was a Belleville type that has
lost those properties? This was not uncommon on Victas.
[This is my reading of the video]

A missing lug should not affect balance of the holder,
nor is it related to the torquing of the holder.
They appear to merely act as locating lugs on assembly.

Perhaps the solution is a new washer...
Any thoughts?
---------------------
Jack

I 'think' I may have made a boo-boo..

Not knowing what a "Belleville washer" is, I googled it.. seems to be a cone-shape washer... I checked the one I have.. yep, its got a slight cone shape to it.. well..unless they can go on either way (which I dont think) .. It is very much a possibility I installed it the wrong way..

G'day Widget

This is a great and helpful story isn't it?
Please let us know the outcome.

I do want to stress that this was not an uncommon problem on Victas.
However, if you have reversed the washer, this may have contributed
to the washer's lost properties.

It may be that a new washer is the fix.

Hope this helps.
-------------------------
Jack

Thanks Cyberjack . Just wondering, how important are the tabs? I know they line up the carrier, but do they offer support? or will having a good washer and tight bolt be fine ?

G'day Widget

That's a great question. You are helping other members here.
I look at things from an historical perspective.

I have said the lugs were locating devices.
Because the boss has a locating centric to locate the holder
that will keep the holder in balance.

The lugs play a secondary role: That is to accommodate
shock loads - say when you hit a fire hydrant hidden in the lawn.
In other words, they deflect wear away from the holder and washer.
So, yes, they do offer support. Yours has lost one-third protection.

However, I feel the best solution here is to fit the washer concave up.
If that doesn't work, replace the washer.
[Victa later went to stamping these washers 'Nut Side'].

In service, we would always replace the washer once its belleville
properties were lost - most probably due to incorrect re-fitting.

Hope this helps.
-----------------------
Jack

Thanks cyberjack

Unfortunately all 3 have broken off so no more support from the lugs/tabs

Ill pickup a new washer just to be sure.

When you say 'concave up', you mean like in this pic ?



I had my washer installed the other way... oops .. guess ill take it as a learning experience

G'day Widget

That is a fantastic illustration of the belleville washer!
Yes, that's how it must be fitted.

This is a learning experience for most folks, and great information
for members who will encounter this.

If you cut residential lawn, this washer replacement will be a sound
repair. Now that three lugs have been lost - be prepared for plan B
in the scenario, given no shock protection from the blade holder boss.

Great story.
-----------------------
Jack