OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums General Discussion Forum Lawn Care & Maintenance Beginner's Guide for Cylinder Mowers?

Hi All,

I have lived in a house with Couch for about 4 years. Before that I had a large buffalo lawn that I had looking great and just used a rotary mower with that.

The previous owner of my house was retired and spent all his time looking after the place. He had a cylinder mower, and when we inspected the house, the lawns were pristine. The best I had ever seen at that time. I was told he mowed several times a week by the neighbours.

Anyway, I moved in and did my best to my knowledge to keep the lawns looking good, and they looked OK for a year or two. They were looking good and I was mowing them with my rotary mower as low as I could with that (it scalped in places if any lower) and I decided to try my father in laws SB45. At the time I decided to leave the height setting as the same as he used as I did not want to interfere with his settings. I mowed it, and it was mowed lower than normal so went yellow. But then a few days later it was not recovering and I realised the lawn had been almost entirely killed off by black beetle/lawn grub. I think the shock of mowing so low combined with the grub eating away for some time al but killed it. It took a long time for it to recover, and I lost interest in the hope of a beautiful lawn. I was frustrated at Couch as I had achieved a beautiful Buffalo lawn with little effort at my previous house.

Fast forward to this Spring. The lawn was covered with weeds and looking terrible, and I was either going to resurrect it or replace with Buffalo. I decided to have a go at resurrecting. It was covered in weeds, and had lots of little piles of dirt from the black beetle. An extensive campaign of spraying weeds/beetle interchanging weekly for a few months has gotten things mostly under control. Still a little evidence of the beetle and some stubborn weeds, but mostly under control. The last 6 weeks of fertilising and regular mowing got it looking as good as it has under my ownership, so I took the plunge last weekend and purchased an SB45 (reconditioned with sharp blades and seems adjusted well) in the hope of keeping the momentum running to get the lawn as close as I can to it's former glory.

So I used the mower last weekend, but due to fear of what happened last time on the borrowed SB45, I ran the height at max setting. The height seemed similar to what I was achieving on my rotary mower, but the finish was better. I really have no idea on the best plan of attack to get the lawn as good as possible. Current plan is to reduce the height weekly until I can get it as low as possible without scalping, but I have no idea how much to reduce and how to measure the height. I can only really commit to mowing once per week, but may be able to do more on occasion. Is there any beginner's guide available for a newbie going from a reasonable rotary mower kept lawn to an immaculate cylinder mower kept lawn? I did also see the guide posted on levelling a couch lawn with sand which I would like to try, but I assume it is too late in the season now (high 30s today/tomorrow!!) to do that, so should wait until next spring?

Also, I live in a property surrounded by tress, so my lawn is always covered in sticks and leaves The rotary mower just munched the sticks and picked up the leaves which was convenient. Last weekend before mowing with the SB45, I picked up the sticks, and left the leaves. I was worried about bending a blade so picked up the sticks, but figured the leaves were not going to damage anything. I noticed the cylinder mower does not seem to pickup the leaves like the rotary does which is a shame. Is there a rough guide on the size of stick that is safe for my SB45. There are many that are quite thin (2-3mm) that I figure should be OK, but obviously I think a 10mm thick would not be? Another option is for me to mow with the rotary first and suck up any leaves and sticks and then run over it with the SB45. Or I could rake it, but that does not sound like much fun!!

My neighbour across the road has a lovely lawn that he maintains with his cylinder mower, so let the battle of the lawns begin!! He has a Mazsport (in the shop for a clutch repair!!), so I think I have an early advantage!

Cheers,

Adrian

Hi Adrian,

Firstly congratulations on joining our wonderful Forum. We're a rather friendly bunch for what we feel is a serious hobby. You'll never be without help here.

If there's one thing you need to know first before doing anything and that is "you can't kill couch" lawn apart from tipping chemicals on it. Don't be scared of cutting it too low nor putting sand over it still at this time of year as we are just getting into summer and it will be a season that will probably go well into April, so you've got plenty of time up your sleeve.

It maybe good if you could post up a few photos of what you are dealing with so that we can assess it and give you the best advise.

Cheers,
BB.

Thanks for the warm welcome. I hope I can contribute more in future.

I will get some photos shortly and post them. That will help in my question below, but I will put the question up anyway.

So it sounds like the Couch is pretty robust. Could I plan to reduce the height until I may scalp it in a few areas of my lawn where there is some bumps and then top dress it with some sand say early January? Is it bad to top dress in the peak heat of summer?

Thanks for you help!

OK, so here are the photos.... an embarrassment compared to most of the photos I see here!! It was mowed on the weekend, and a few days of very hot weather have it looking a little worse for wear.

Hi Adrian,

Wow ! that's a fair amount of lawn to deal with in one go I must say, also you've got a gorgeous garden and home design / location there.

One thing that does concern me a little bit though is that quite a bit of it must be in the shade from those trees and rock garden walls most of the day. Santa Ana Couch generally likes to have 6 hours of sun on it per day so this might be a bit of an challenge in its rapid recovery.

Maybe you could clarify this for me as I don't live there and don't know your particular daily sun situation.

As far as the actual lawn is concerned I feel it is rather thatchy and scalping it probably won't be enough as due to its age it will also require scarification which is the process of de-thatching the root system (subsurface) which is choking itself. Since you will have to do that I would delay all the work until October next year and just keep up the normal mowing at this stage to keep up the greenness on top.

BTW you'll have to either organise someone to do the scarification work for you or hire the machine to do it yourself from a say, Kennards Hire outlet etc. Scarification has to be done every few years to keep up the lawns youth. If you intend to do it yourself we can walk you through that process but it will be a good days work for the amount of lawn you have there.

Just wish we could do the same to ourselves.

Cheers,
BB.

Thanks for your help BB. We love living at this location. It is in West Pennant Hills in Sydney if you know the area. It backs onto bush so there are lots of trees/leaves/sticks to deal with which makes the lawn a bit more challenging.

Most of the yard would get a fair bit of sun for most of the day. The Sun goes behind the trees behind the house about 2-3pm, but it would get some sun from fairly early (7-8am). There are some parts of the lawn that have localised shade. The area in the last photo suffers the most in this regard. It is the lowest part of the lawn, and has poor drainage so is often quite wet and has some moss also, but the grass is poorest in this area.

A couple of months ago I got one of those hand lawn coring tools from bunnings and used that. I thought that was all that is required, but I just googled this scarification process and it seems what I need to do. From what you say it may be too late to do this so I should wait until next spring? What would be the effect of doing this mid summer? I am the DIY type of person and would prefer to hire a machine and do it myself to save $$$ and learn a bit more in the process (and avoid taking out sprinkler system). Is there any threads on this forum with the details on doing this to save repeating it here?

I do agree about the scarification of my own body... mid 40s and things have taken a turn since 40!!

So moving forward with the mowing assuming no scarification to be done in the short term, Is there any recommendations on how to set the height on the SB45 and how to adjust it over time (Do I slowly bring it down or just set it at a height and scalp it in one hit). I understand the height adjustment on the front roller, but I am not sure how to measure the height or estimate from the position in the arc the adjuster moves through (half/quarter etc.). It is hot in Sydney today, but a cool change and a few cooler days from this evening, so I am thinking it is a good time to mow again and possible reduce the height.

Cheers,

Adrian

Hi Adrian,

I think you said that you had your Scotty on it's highest setting and if that's the case this tells me that your lawn is very much bulging up of thatch, also the photos certainly show this.

If you were to cut it back there's no point in lowering the reel mowers setting gradually, you'll just never get any green surface on it this way, rather bite the bullet and get a rotary mower that will have the ability to get down really low and do it in stages reducing the height setting over each pass of the whole lawn. Many rotary just won't get down low enough so that you can only see the base soil and thus have all your neighbours talking behind your back saying how this guys just killed off his lawn. Little do they really know as that's exactly the response I got and now I have all the folk commenting on how great the lawn looks.

Basically you need to scalp it all in one day. We are always trying to use the cylinder cut mower at it's lower end settings and never high.

I hope you've got a big trailer as the amount of clippings are going to be awesome.

After that I'd give it a dosing of Scotts Lawn Builder and water in well. This will reduce the work load next spring with you only having to spend a short time on re-scalping and getting straight into the scarification early in the morning and finishing it by lunchtime and getting the machine back to it's owner as most of them charge by the hour to try and avoid you doing multiple lawns, thus wearing the machine out quicker. Also this is to stop contractors from getting hold of them and making lots of money at a cheap hiring rate.

The area you've described is the area I was referring to as I could see the moss build up. Maybe you could remove the lawn from that area and reallocate the space to something else as the lawn will always be susceptible to disease in that damp area.

Cheers,
BB.

PS I see that you are surrounded by a whole lot of other house proud home owners, so you've got to carry on the tradition don't you ?

Thanks BB,

I mentioned initially that I had once used a borrowed SB45 on a lowish setting and my lawn had seemed to die completely. There were magpies all over it , and it seemed to me that lawn beetle had done this and I hope I have this under control now. If I go crazy with the mower and scalp it right down, could this happen again?

I have a rotary mower that can go a lot lower than I have mowed it before. I find any lower than 5 and I scalp some areas of the lawn with bumps. I could go really low (a setting of 1 would be dragging the blades close to the wheel height). I am concerned with killing it all by going too low... Going to take some convincing of my wife who has threatened consequences if I kill it like a couple of years ago!

Finally.... Spring is the time to do the scarification, but it sounds like your suggestion of scalping with the mower could be a similar impact on the lawn. Could I just do the scarification now?

Yeah... lots of nice houses where I live.... but only a few really nice lawns. Mine is one of the better ones now, but my neighbour is probably the best... so I have to lift my game!!

I must admit that my first impression of the lawn agrees with BB's post that there looks to be a lot of shade from trees & that retaining wall. The large tree in the middle of the front lawn adjacent to the path is going to cause issues with getting the maximum density from the grass.

With regard to scarifying I always have the opinion that any time is a good time providing the grass is actively growing. If there is a thatch issue then I would say it is better to correct that issue as that will impede water and nutrients from reaching the roots as well as providing a haven for pests and disease. That being said if you do proceed with either a hard scalp or a scarify you must nurse the grass back afterward with a bit of love, namely with water and fertiliser.

Do you have an irrigation system installed?

Hi SimRice,

Not sure if I can totally agree with you on the point of scarification too late in the season when the grass doesn't get the opportunity to recover fully as you suggest in your last line about nursing it back and then goes into dormant mode.
That's definitely not the best way, but I will agree with the issue of the hard scalp to avoid the issues you suggest and that's why I came up with that prognosis and leave scarification to early next season giving it the full time to come back and thicken up due to the restricted sun light issues.

Don't take this the wrong way Simon and I totally understand where you're coming from as we've discussed mowers and height of grass before in depth, but your expectation of grass is radically different to what the average home owner wants.

Cheers,
BB.

Thanks SimRice,

Yeah, it is not an ideal lawn in terms of other trees/shade etc, so I just hope to get it as good as I can. It has been pretty good in the past, so will be happy with that.

I am thinking a de-thatch earlier rather than later might be good. I have a couple weeks leave over Christmas so that might be the time. I presume the scarifying machines are probably better than the lawn mower scalp? Is there any info on this process available on the net? I presume I want to get the lawn in good health before doing this.... fertiliser/water and mowed short a couple weeks out?

I have a good irrigation system, so that is easy.

I am going to mow this evening, and I will bring the SB45 down a bit. Any references on the best way to set height in a measurable way? Was thinking a straight edge across rollers and tape measure to bread knife blade? Maybe aim for 20mm or so?

Cheers,

Adrian

Process is as follows,

1 Scalp (with Rotary Mower)
2 Scarify (with Scarifying Machine)
3 Rake out excessive roots that have been cut out by scarifier
4 Level, Roll, Top Dress and re-level. Re- top dress as required (trial and error)
5 Fertilise and water in well
6 Water daily

Simple as all that, but rather time consuming if it hasn't been done in quite a few years.

Thanks BB! Is that an all in one day job (as in top dress immediately after scarifying)?

I mowed this evening only a few days after the initial mow. Lowered the height to 20mm (measured by putting a straight edge between rollers and tape measure to top edge of bread knife blade). Filled a large Sulo bin with grass. Was lucky to be mowing for 2 minutes before needing to empty catcher. Scalped most of the lawn and looking not very green now. Raining now. I will try to take a photo tomorrow.

I discovered my (pretty powerful backpack) blower is a good way to clear the lawn of anything short of large sticks before mowing, so that is quicker than raking.

I have mowed twice with the SB45 over the last week. First time at 20mm (as mentioned in previous post). Took a lot of grass clippings off. I then did back to 15mm and took about the same amount of clippings off again. The lawn is mostly brown now and I am hoping it is OK. I want to mow one more time before the green bins (I have 2 large) go out on Sunday. That leaves me with 2 green bins and I plan to do the scarification process. I expect I will need more than the two bins, but hopefully that does most of it. I am watering a lot and it is pretty hot in Sydney at the moment, so I think the grass should come back quick when it does.

Just a question... When you scalp it, you mow away the green leaves and are left with brown. Where were the leaves growing from? Were they coming from the living tendrils in the thatch, or were they growing through the thatch from the soil underneath? By dethatch, are we removing living parts of the grass as well as old thatch that have died?

Hello vosadrian,

My suggestion would be to cut it right back to the soil (this is called scalping) so that you actually see the soil. All of what you are cutting away is basically both living and some dead matter but it is only the top section that receives sunlight that has green foliage coming from it.

The quicker you can get it back to just the root system in the ground and then scarified then the quicker it will recover. Doing this process bit by bit isn't doing the grass any real favours.

Cheers,
BB.

Thanks BB,

Planning to do this in a few days. Which levelling material is my best choice:

Sands
Sydney / Newcastle sand Rendering, floor tiling, sandpits
White Bush sand Bricklaying
Yellow Bush sand Bricklaying
Coarse wash sand Under paving, making concrete
Nepean washed sand Under paving, making concrete
Fill sand General fill applications, under concrete slabs

Soils
Lawn Mix
35% Soil
45% River Sand
10% Chicken Manure
10% Premium Compost
Quailty Lawn mix for use as a top dress for established lawns or as a turf underlay for new lawns. Water well after laying
Turf Underlay 45% Screened Recycled Soil
45% River Sand
10% Ash
A free draining soil mix suitable for use under all turf varieties

I have around 250m2. So I assume around 2.5 tonnes to start with?

Cheers,

Adrian

Hi Adrian,

I would be using a basic Brickies sand (deep orange in colour) which has more goodness in it. The more washed it is the less nutrients are in it.

Remember you are using this to fill in the low spots and not do a total covering of the surface unless the whole area is low and requires lifting.

Cheers,
BB.