OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Collectors Corner Identification of Particular Machines Victa Model 4 Automatic Specifications

This is true Jonesy, the more the better. Its definitely starting to form a clearer picture. What was our highest example? One of yours was Around 126, 000 wasnt it? I contacted the last ebay sold version withe the front flap remnants and unfortunately it was a 164, 000 serial, so I didnt bother 2 include it. So as yet we have seen no real evidence of an accurate example above that proposed 128, 000 mark yet. I guess we keep searching for examples to help clarify and determine an accurate end to the autos run. I never asked you to check your unconfirmed examples Jonesy. ..the best way to tell is take tge front axle mounts off and check for a prominant curved wear groove in the base where the front flap rod runs. Thats of course unless you already knew this lols.

Good point Jonesy. Blumbly's #122228 looks to be the genuine article, so I reckon a minimum of #122000 is pretty much certain.

Blue, you mention wear around the rod receiving notches.My example has a broken clip on the rear left axle housing which I always presumed was caused by the old rear flap being ripped off when the owner had jack of it. As such, I always check for broken catches as an indicator of an Auto being the real deal. The following Auto looks like the front flap was ripped off with some pretty serious force. Its serial #125961:

HA HA the handle bar clamp looked like it copped a flogging too, probably from smashing the front of the mower into the wall to get the flap off
also has the custom radiator hose air pipe and has got the spare on the back, poor old girl.

And yes Blue my one with the front flap bits on it is 125166, so maybe it did'nt get an engine change after all?? the plot thickens.

Cool.another serial.to the list. Id say he had a head on with a garden gnome! Yeah I reakon there.were a few owners pissed of.when their autos packed it in and decided to go the crow bar option...

Hmmmm. Do those check unkie and myself suggested and it might help comfirm its accuracy and add another to the list.

Lol, yeah you can almost see the poor kid thrashing the thing around the yard, hating life coz his dad made him mow the lawn, and totally destroying it against the side of the house in frustration

engine number 156532 just how i found it in mid 80ties
all the goodies but no automatic running gear not sign of any front or rear flap wear


running gear

G'day Gman. Thanks for posting those pics, they're excellent and a great contribution to the thread.

I'll offer my own thoughts on your mower, for what they're worth Firstly, the serial number would suggest it is out of the range for a genuine Auto. Evidence so far collected suggests a range of 110,000 to around 127,000 to be correct for the Automatic, but that's not yet set in stone. Along with any information on the Auto, new evidence is appearing all the time, and as such,the record is constantly being amended. This thread is a testament to that!

I tend to run through a checklist of features when identifying an Auto. Firstly, the serial should sit within the range I mentioned. Secondly, does it have an Auto badge. Many mock-up Automatics have been assembled over the years, and equally, many Autos have lost their badges, so the presence of a badge must be considered, but in no way relied upon.

Thirdly, does the mower have skirt retaining bolts. These four bolts are notoriously fragile, and are very difficult to remove. Often, any attempt to remove them will sheer them off leaving half the bolt in the deck. The complete absence of bolts, or evidence of them having been there for a true Auto would be very rare and not something I personally have ever seen.

Fourthly, the fuel cap should be painted green. Allot of misinformation and hearsay has alluded to painted fuel caps being fakes. This is point blank untrue as the evidence demonstrates. Early Auto's ran an opaque plastic cap painted with Hammertone, whilst the later stages of the model ran a green plastic cap, which was also painted. From what I have seen, all of the Model 4 Specials ran the same green plastic cap, but they were unpainted. Again, this is not to be relied upon as an indicator of authenticity, as the paint often wore off over time.

My fifth check is the carby. It should have the twin throttle cap and brass slide, with both ports on the cap having been drilled and threaded. Often, caps appear that have two ports, with only one of which that's been drilled. These appeared right up into the Model 5 so should be disregarded as being evidential of being an Automatic.

Next we have the fuel tap. It should be of the cigar type, but these also appeared in after market form with grooved casings, so beware. Finally, the starter appeared in two styles during the life of the model one, but a uniform trait was the green rubber cover on the started handle. As far as I know, the black rubber handle appeared during the life of the model 5.

A few other variable indicators are demonstrated during the life of the Automatic, including painted axle housings for the earlier model examples, and large dome nuts on the handlebar clamp changing to long hex later in the serial run. Once all these factors are considered, I then move onto the Predicta mechanism, or most often lack there of. As you mentioned, mowers that formerly had the setup often leave evidence of this. I've always considered broken axle housing retaining clips as a good indicator of a front or rear flap having been torn away. Equally, prominent signs of wear in those areas is also a good indicator of a now missing Predicta mechanism. While there are many other considerations, this is the basic checklist I run through.

In regards to your mower, my own subjective opinion is that it began life as a Model 4 Special (Standard) from mid 1958, which would have come without a starter or badge. I've got one just like it in the 154,000s. I suspect that at some point somebody has added the badge, carby and a later model 5 starter and groove cover, perhaps to create their own Automatic, but I'm often wrong, so don't count on it! There is speculation that many Auto parts were simply "used up" after the demise of the Automatic and may have been added on the assembly line, but regardless of this being fact or fiction, true examples of the Automatic should tick many if not all of the boxes I mentioned above.If nothing else, your mower demonstrates what is often confused for the genuine article, and they often come up. Regardless of all that, I think it's a great mower with some rare parts, especially that Model 5 rubber starter cover!

Thanks again for posting

For the archives, here are the last images of my front flap before it was sold. Enjoy!

Hi Unkie,
And thanks for the pics, this is brilliant for the archives.
We all hope that the flap has gone to a good home, and our congrats on the final sale price.

Yes Fantastic Unkie...A more accurate genuine example Will never be seen again I dare say. What an incredible and valuable piece for the Archives.

And yes I too hope it went to a good home and congrats on the sale...

This is a Model 4 base I have. (Since Donated it to a fellow member for his Restoration project).

Now this mower I got many years ago,and was seeminlgy just a basic model 4. I stripped it down for restore and never got to it,and all the parts were put under my bench and forgotten.
Upon pulling it out and checking for cracks before I gave it to the member,i noticed the clear wear marks on the front axle extensions of the base.

The engine with this mower is 128,--- which is almost certainly in the Automatic Serial run. So it appears all this time My little model 4 plain jane once started life as an Automatic.

The point of this post is so you can see the wear marks from the front flap rod that have worn into the alloy over time,and also confirm our highest Automatic Example..... This is a very accurate ways to tell if it once had the Predicta set up.

As this is sandblasted you can see the groove reasonably well,but Generally you would see no paint a clear groove and rust marks from steel on alloy. This would not appear on a plain model 4 mower.

So when your checking out you model 4 and it falls in the serial range we are reasearching, 110,000 to 128,000 definate. And 128,000 to 148,000 unconfirmed. (Its the latter serials we are looking for mostly,) please let us know if you or someone you know has these numbers.

You're welcome fellas, and thanks, i'm chuffed for the new owner. He's an awesome guy and will do it justice, I've no doubt. I'm a big advocate of the free access to information, and hopefully these images and the collective contributions of all that have participated in this thread, will go a long way towards not only preserving the historical record of this model, but ensure that collectors can identify genuine examples of these increasingly valuable mowers. From the outset, I've intended to draw together a resource that is accessible for FREE - I'm of the school of thought that knowledge should never have a price tag.

Sadly, within the broader Victa community, with the exception of a good many ODK members (you know who you are ;)) , I've noticed a general unwillingness to contribute and share knowledge. Why they'd rather take to the grave what could encourage a whole new generation of collectors baffles me. The thirst for information is clearly out there, and with some 1,000 page views a day, this thread is a testament to that. So to all you silent viewers, come and get on board! Share what you know and make what is currently an excellent resource, an incredible resource.

Anyway, rant over lol. Just having one of those days

This base has definitely gone to a good home hopwfully it will get an automatic setup put on it if it comes along when I got the money considering thw prices they are making so far everything has been cleaned and polished up tomorrow im off to get the paint matched so it can finaly get a coat of paint and start the build up
And thanks again mate

hello all. whilst i dont have an auto with the correct numbers it has been suggested and is a great probability that this mower of mine may just have began its life as a true auto.
i have posted some pics of it here elsewhere on another thread but after reading all these postings and discovering it again in my shed i noticed some things mentioned here and thought it would be ok to post here.it seems to have signs of a rear flap being torn off at some stage in its life

Great post Blue. I'd reckon that method for identifying genuine Autos is just about fool proof. At 128,000 even I'm surprised they've gone that high. Just can't argue with that kind of evidence.

And Gizmo, I'd say you 100% have an Auto there. The wear on the those axle housings is just about as clear as you could hope to find. I reckon it must have run a good few years with the setup attached to achieve that kind of wear, not to mention the breakages. What engine number has it got now?

This is up on ebay and is a fantastic serial number record. whilst it doesn't tell us what type of mower the guarantee was for, it does give a very nice month/serial number correlation. It's quite faded, but reads:

Feb 20th, 1958 - Serial #141973

hey unk the motor on mine has definately been changed? as its way over the 128000 mark.ICAA 21258 ,but now i am pretty sure its a real auto base i will have to hunt for the elusive engine???
its on this link and i was only going by the old photos i took when i originally bought it.i only had pics of the front axle.
https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/u...amp;Main=9298&Number=54853#Post54853

tried up loading a MPEG wont load Bugger

Just invite me over for a barbie,and ill just sit and watch you mow the lawns with my Video Camera! lols....Youll get it Gaz,try uploading to youtube and posting the link instead:) Its been a few years since ive seen one running...Cant wait to check out another in Action. And I dont think many people have ever seen one in operation.